INTERVIEW WITH CHUCK
ZITO
SECONDS: First off, why did you join the Hells Angels?
ZITO: I used to watch their movies when I was a kid. I remember
going to see Hells Angels On Wheels when I was twelve years old
and then Hells Angels '69. They inspired me to ride a motorcycle.
I made a mini-bike when I was twelve years old, that's how I
started. When I was old enough to ride a motorcycle and got my
license, I bought a '69 Sportster. I was boxing in Gramercy Gym
and I met the president of the Hells Angels, Sandy Alexander,
who was also a professional boxer.
SECONDS: How old were you then?
ZITO: I joined the club when I was twenty-five, so I was like twenty-three
at the time. I used to belong to another club from the Bronx
called the Ching-A-Ling Nomads. I Introduced myself as a Ching-A-Ling
and he introduced himself as a Hells Angel. I was excited to
meet the guy.
SECONDS: How does somebody become a Hells Angel?
ZITO: You have to hang around first. It's called the "hang
around" process. You get to know them, they get to know you
and see if they like you. Then they'll vote on you to become a
prospect. You have to be sponsored by a Hells Angel. One "no" vote
and you're out.
SECONDS: Why did you want to become a Hells Angel?
ZITO: Like I said, when I was a kid, they inspired me.
SECONDS: Right, but then you were a twenty-five-year-old adult.
What was it about them that you saw then?
ZITO: I belonged to another club, and liked the camaraderie. There
was no club but the Hells Angels as far as I was concerned. The
only reason I joined the other club was because I didn't know there
were any Hells Angels in New York at the time. But when I saw them,
I was infatuated by them. They were the elite, they were the number
one club, they were it.
SECONDS: What makes the Hells Angels special? Why do they differ
from other clubs?
ZITO: Even before I was a Hells Angel, I was in the Ching-A-Lings.
We considered ourselves the number two club, like all other clubs
do, because you're proud to be a member of that club. But we always
knew that the Hells Angels were the trendsetters. They were the
original outlaws of motorcycle riders. Let's go back to July 4,
1947, to Hollister, California where the AMA—the American
Motorcycle Association—sanctioned the Gypsy Tour Run, when
the Booze Fighters, POBOBs—Pissed Off Bastards Of Bloomington—and
the Market Street Commandos took over the town for nearly three
days. Two months later, the same clubs go to Riverside, California
for the Labor Day weekend, another AMA sanctioned event. The same
thing happens like in Hollister. Over four thousand people, bikers
and citizens, took over the town's main street. A Riverside sheriff,
Carl Rayburn, blames a bunch of punk kids for disrupting his town.
They're rebels, they're outlaws. So from an angry lawman's mouth,
the Outlaw Motorcyclists were born. Six months later the POBOBs
became the first Hells Angels charter on March 17, 1948, in San
Bernardino, California, also known as "Berdoo." Then
that same year, the AMA made a statement that ninety-nine percent
of the motorcyclists are good people enjoying a clean sport and
it's the one percent that are anti-social barbarians. The term "One
Percenters" is born. On April 1st, 1957, Ralph "Sonny" Barger
started the Oakland Hells Angels. In 1959, Sonny called a meeting
with all the old bike clubs—the Gypsy Jokers, the Galloping
Gooses, Satan's Slaves and everybody else. They decided to ally
themselves under a "One Percenter" patch. That's where
they designed that diamond-shaped One Percent patch. Sonny and
another Hells Angel who was at the meeting thought they were beyond
a little patch so they headed down to a local tattoo shop in Oakland
and were the first to get the famous One Percent tattoos. So it
just goes to show you that it was always the Hells Angels first.
They were the originals and all other clubs try and imitate what
the Hells Angels have already done.
SECONDS: How many charters are there?
ZITO: There's probably about 150 charters in the world. We're the
biggest international club there is.
SECONDS: There's so many of you. How do you get to know each other?
ZITO: It's not that I've met every Hells Angel in the world, but
I've met Hells Angels from every charter at one time or another.
SECONDS: Do you have conferences once a year?
ZITO: We have what's called a USA Run, where every Hells Angel
in the United States meets at a certain location. They have the
same thing in Europe. Then we have a World Run, where representatives
from all the charters meet. When we have a run, it's for families;
it's for Hells Angels to get together, people who are new in
the club, people who are old. See, I'm fortunate that I get around
a lot because of my movie business. I'm in California a lot;
I go overseas sometimes and I meet more Hells Angels than other
Angels do. Through word of mouth a lot of people know who I am.
Some people see me on the screen and read about me in books and
magazines and know me from there.
SECONDS: On the other hand, the Hells Angels have a notorious
reputation.
ZITO: It depends who you talk to. The media always gets a little
carried away. We got that reputation from Altamont in 1969, where
a Hells Angel stabbed a concertgoer. It made big headlines but
it didn't say in the paper he had a gun and was trying to shoot
Mick Jagger and a Hells Angel, and he got stabbed for his troubles.
The Hells Angel was acquitted a week later but you never read about
it.
SECONDS: What about the Methamphetamines? The Government says
the Hells Angels are the biggest Methamphetamine dealers in the
United States and you're all millionaires.
ZITO: Let me tell you something: I have members in my charter who,
after paying their rent and house bills and taking care of their
families, don't even have enough money left over to pay the fifteen
dollars a week dues.
SECONDS: So what you're saying is don't believe everything you
read?
ZITO: Exactamundo.
SECONDS: So your organization doesn't sell drugs?
ZITO: Myself, I don't drink, I don't smoke and I never took a drug
in my life but yet I'm supposed to be this drug-taking, drug-selling
Hells Angel and belong to a criminal organization. The thing
that pisses me off, and it's happened time and time again—almost
every article I read about the Hells Angels is either by the
Government or some other law enforcement agency or some jerk-off
trying to make a quick buck off our name, and they write a book
about the club…but yet none of them know jack shit about
what they're talking about. When people hear about the Hells
Angels, they don't know if it's myth, rumors or just plain bullshit.
Even if we get a retraction later on down the road, the damage
is already done. The bad stuff sticks in people's minds whether
it's true or not. Now as far as the organization selling drugs,
no. Individuals selling drugs is something else.
SECONDS: So individuals do sell drugs?
ZITO: Individuals in many organizations do a lot of different things.
Most recently, fifteen cops from New York City's 48th Precinct
were indicted for various crimes—drugs, shakedowns, extortions,
et cetera. Does that mean we're going to condemn the whole police
department for what a few individuals did? Most certainly not.
So if one, or two, or a handful of guys sells drugs for their
own personal gain and profit who just so happens to be a member
of the Hells Angels Motorcycle Club, we want that same consideration.
SECONDS: You are also a professional bodyguard. Who are some of
the people whose bodies you have guarded?
ZITO: You could probably ask who haven't I guarded. I've guarded
everybody from Liza Minneli to Sean Penn, Charlie Sheen, Mickey
Rourke, Eric Roberts, Charles Bronson, Sylvester Stallone.
SECONDS: As a bodyguard, have you ever had to hit someone?
ZITO: Not exactly hit them, but I've restrained a few people. See,
I like to employ wrist-locks and arm-bars and walk them out of
a situation without the client even knowing what's happened.
When I was guarding Liza, there was a guy up on the fire escape
with a long trenchcoat on and when we walked out, I saw him reach
into his jacket like he was going for a gun. I pushed Liza out
of the way and grabbed this guy. I had one hand on his arm that
was in the coat and one hand around his adam's apple. I pulled
his arm out and he wound up having a camera in there. The next
thing I thought about was him suing us. Of course, people wound
up getting front-row tickets for Liza's show and it was all taken
care of….
SECONDS: What kind of training have you had?
ZITO: I've been fighting my whole life. I've trained in six different
styles of martial arts; two forms of Kung Fu—White Crane
and Tiger Claw Kung Fu—Isshinryu Karate, Jukido Jujitsu,
Kumite Ryu Jujitsu, Vee Arnis Jitsu; and I've trained in three
different styles of weapons: Kamas—thirteen-inch sticks
with a blade attached to them—and also nunchakus and bo
staffs. I'm proficient in every art.
SECONDS: What about boxing?
ZITO: Since I was five years old. My father was a professional
fighter—his name was Al La Barba.
SECONDS: How many fights did he have?
ZITO: 228 fights and twelve losses—and never knocked out.
He fought in the Thirties and Forties and started out as a Lightweight
and moved up to Welterweight. I don't know any other sport except
fighting. I don't know basketball, football, hockey, baseball—I
just know fighting.
SECONDS: Have you ever backed down from a fight?
ZITO: No. If the challenge to fight was there, I always took it.
SECONDS: While speaking of challenges, you act also.
ZITO: Yes, I started acting two years ago. I was a stuntman for
over fifteen years. Almost every action film, you can see my
name in the credits—Die Hard 3, The Specialist, True Lies,
Carlito's Way, Heat, A Bronx Tale, Eraser, The Last Action Hero—I'd
have to look at my resume because there's so many.
SECONDS: What interests you in acting? Money? Fame? The art?
ZITO: I did a movie back in 1979 with Meat Loaf and Cher called
Dead Ringer and that was my first stunt job. In fact, there were
eighteen Hells Angels in that movie. I got my SAG card through
that movie. Next, I met Mickey Rourke during The Pope of Greenwich
Village and started to be his bodyguard and personal trainer.
Then, I worked on Year of The Dragon with him.
SECONDS: Did you inspire Mickey to get into riding motorcycles?
ZITO: I gave Mickey his first Harley Davidson. I guess you could
say I started him in the bike craze. He was known as the "Bad
Boy Of Hollywood" and then Mickey started everybody else
in Hollywood with riding.
SECONDS: How does Harley Davidson feel about the Angels?
ZITO: Thirty years ago, they loved the Hells Angels but now that
they're so big, Harley Davidson has distanced themselves from
the club—even though the Hells Angels and other outlaw
motorcycle clubs were buying all their bikes.
SECONDS: And making them famous.
ZITO: Making them famous is right. All we'd ride is an American-made
motorcycle and Harley Davidson is the only one there is.
SECONDS: What do you think of Japanese bikes?
ZITO: I have nothing against anybody who rides a motorcycle but
personally, those bikes make a shitty fucking noise. They sound
like a blender or lawnmower. There's something about the meaty
sound of a Harley…
SECONDS: Do you find acting exciting?
ZITO: What it is, Phil, I watch a lot of these actors and I say
to myself, "I could do it better." They're trying to
act like what I am—but they're acting, they're not doing
it every day. I had a little part in The Specialist but they
took my part away because I looked too much like Stallone. I
had a scene with him and the director yells, "Cut!" and
says, "Chuck, I've got to pull you out of this—you
look too much like Sly." I said, "Well, then pull him
out of the way."
SECONDS: Are you more comfortable in the ring or in front of a
camera?
ZITO: I think in front of a camera—a camera's not hitting
me back, you know? But I'm very comfortable. I like fighting—
SECONDS: Why do you like fighting?
ZITO: Because I grew up with the sport. It's the first thing I
knew how to do well.
SECONDS: If you get in a street fight and you break somebody's
jaw, do you feel bad?
ZITO: Not at all.
SECONDS: Why not?
ZITO: Because they were trying to break my jaw. It's either hit
or get hit, so I try to do the hitting. I'll try to talk myself
out of a fight—sometimes—but then there's only so
much talking you can do before you get it on. If I know I'm going
to get it on with a guy, I'm going to hit him first.
SECONDS: You're a pretty fierce looking guy. Why would someone
want to challenge you?
ZITO: They do. I don't understand it myself. It's not one guy,
it's usually a few guys. I go every place by myself no matter what
city, state or country it is, and most of the time I'm wearing
my Hells Angel jacket. It's always three guys that want to challenge
you— "Is he as bad as he thinks?" That's how it
starts. It's like the old West, I guess. Maybe you're not carrying
a gun on your side but you've got two hands to throw punches and
guys want to take their chances. Most of them find out it was the
wrong thing to do. I'm still here and still pretty like Ali.
SECONDS: In conclusion what was more intimidating to you: fighting
three guys at once or being onstage?
ZITO: Being onstage. That was more intimidating. The three guys
I knew I could handle, no problem. But the audience looking at
me, I was scared. Every time I said my line, I said, "Okay,
I got through that one—keep going." I remember I left
out a whole paragraph that I was supposed to say first and I wound
up putting it at the end. But it worked out and I didn't get scared.
The audience didn't know I screwed up, and I didn't let them know
I screwed up and had fear in me. It's just showbiz. I play any
character they pay me to be. If you pay me, I'll get beat up. I
get beat up in a lot of these movies—which doesn't happen
in real life.
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